While that is true, and probing has many benefits, I think that probing is too complicated for the starting player. It used to be that you had to launch one probe, and that fulfilled the mission. I would compromise at "Launch a probe and find a SPC system", with directions telling you how to do it.

Not "Launch 50 probes and find 5 systems because you don't have enough nearby planets do to so."

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A storm is coming, a storm is coming in..

20:48:19 | Professor planet 0 from paladin
20:20:21 | Arcanix planet 14 Arcanix 01

Diplomacy & Trading Forum Moderator.

This is true, but then links back into the old arguement of how well do we prepare new players for the real arena? Personally I'm finding it hard to strike the balance. I like the idea of teaching new players a fair amount about everything just in case they don't wish to join a Clan and can then stand on their own two feet. But at the same time doing that takes resources and time which can lead to boredom for new players while they wait for that to build up. I seem to remember even when the newbie missions were easy that there was a lot of hurry up and wait.


Alongside this, the game is definately clan orientated, which means that for the most part you shouldn't have to teach everything in the newbie arena as much of it can be taught afterwards. Personally, at the moment I'm striking the balance at teaching the basis of survival. What to gather, what ships are useful to build and in what sizes, how to capture planets and use them effectively, how to break chains effectively and how to find planets. By this at the moment I do include probing (although I'm pretty open on this arguement) as it can be fairly useful. This is especially true if you aren't active enough to Warp regularly (or are unfortunate enough to be online at the same time as Omnibus) and none of your planets have nearby.

What I'd suggest therefore is perhaps a walkthrough mission of Probing (with an increase in base resources to make it possible. Perhaps set up so that the planet you capture in the mission before the probing lesson has the resources required for probing) that isn't a great deal more difficult than the original "SEND PROBE HERE" mission that many of us went through. But alongside this I'd put up SL Cribs; Probing Guides, Assault Training Guides etc... that are downloadable.

I'm not talking the walkthrough stuff we have in the new players forum, I'm thinking more an interactive spreadsheet - you put in where you want to probe, it'll tell you how many probes (and therefore how many resources) you'll need and where to send them. Similarly for assault training, it'll tell you how many troops are needed for a certain kind of planet and how many captures. Same for fighter training.

The big benefit I see to this is that you don't have to hold people up uneccessarily in the Newbie Arena to perform missions, but you supply them with the basic survival tools at the same time. Personally I think this library tab should be open when you're in the Real Arena as well so that anyone can access them.

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Make your move, reindeer games.

I just think the New Player Missions should be faster, and easily completed within an hour. Then give them their 14 days of immunity in which they should continue to learn how to probe, so they can join a clan, etc. etc.

I feel that probing is the most complicated of the missions, and so to get rid of it would speed up player entry into the game and give them a better chance to get started.

At least we could start by giving new players adequate resources.

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A storm is coming, a storm is coming in..

20:48:19 | Professor planet 0 from paladin
20:20:21 | Arcanix planet 14 Arcanix 01

Diplomacy & Trading Forum Moderator.

problem is, for a new player to be successful it is important to use there newbie arena to its potential. stay and build up for almost a month which makes me think noobs should stay in nooby arena for a month regardless of when they join the game unless they want to go to real arena, this will make the arena more active andthen hopefully be more willing to stay and build up

Point is, they get bored with the game, confused with how it works, or simply don't enjoy it like we do. They can pick up strategy as they go, but it's still difficult to keep them into the game.

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A storm is coming, a storm is coming in..

20:48:19 | Professor planet 0 from paladin
20:20:21 | Arcanix planet 14 Arcanix 01

Diplomacy & Trading Forum Moderator.

That's been one of the principle problems in the game since it's creation, hence why it is so hard to find a balance between newbie and real. If you can provide the survival aids (i.e SL Library idea promulgated above) then I'm in favour of a far shorter newbie arena. If you have a Library of spreadsheets etc.. or readthroughs of how things work then a new player can zip through the missions and arena, come forth into the Real Arena and then read up and pick the bits of strategy that appeal to them.

The only real downside I see to this is how prepared players will be. Not just in terms of strategy and game understanding, but in terms of actually having the resources to establish themselves. If you come into the Real Arena with a mini-HW you've got a fair chance of having it disappear. The Newbie Arena offers that time for you to build up. How we tackle that issue is one I'm not entirely sure about. One thing that I did bounce around for a bit was the idea of Vet Moderators who were allowed accounts that never left the Newbie Arena, just to spice it up, but had a cap on the size of planet they could take.

Mostly I'm just spit balling ideas, but it's a tricky problem and I'm not sure there is a right answer to it, just a variety of options.

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Make your move, reindeer games.

You have a good chance of being prepared once you establish yourself in a clan, and with the rest of the SL community. The major killer of new players isn't veterans and us in the real arena, it's them becoming inactive and such. I think with a shorter newbie mission, new players will benefit from the help we can give. I've been PMing every new player that's joined, with no response from any of them..

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A storm is coming, a storm is coming in..

20:48:19 | Professor planet 0 from paladin
20:20:21 | Arcanix planet 14 Arcanix 01

Diplomacy & Trading Forum Moderator.

A thought - what about conditional immunity and no newbie arena?

Regarding resources - they have enough if they harvest (mission 2) and don't crash ships, etc, to take at least 15 planets, iirc.

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SkyLords Head Programmer

Spelled: I I R I (not irii, irri, or iri).

Force of nature.

I hesitate on what to train new players on, because the game is very defined by the players. Terms and usage shift, as do gameplay patterns -- I prefer the new player missions to more teach the interface of the game, and as few basics as possible, so they can also participate in redefining the game - and perhaps unset a confident vet or two? I'm hoping, anything to be possible.

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SkyLords Head Programmer

Spelled: I I R I (not irii, irri, or iri).

Force of nature.

Iiri, it took me 3 days to establish 15 planets. possibly because i didnt have probing updates to but all my nearbyes were x20s with 30k defense and i did not have enough iron to make a 50k assault until the second day, then at that point i had 6 planets producing troops and it took forever to make 90k to capture them